Roy: Hello, gang. It’s Monday again or maybe you’re watching this after Monday.
Daniel: So there.
Roy: Thank you for sending. We’ve got ten really great questions and we’re going to dive in. We’re going to try to get through all these and buy ourselves enough time for a weird, little special treat at the end. If it seems like I’m going faster than usual, it’s because I’m going faster than usual. Yeah. Anyway, read the first part.
Daniel: All right. Here we go. Hey, Roy. I’ve been a Copywriter since late ’92. As you can imagine, I’ve seen some crap and sadly written some as well. I need to ask you about your creative approach to art institutions, art museums, galleries, opera, theater, museums, and symphonies. They all want and need the same thing, butts in seats and new membership.
In my head and heart, these are the places whose campaigns could and should be creatively amazing, but invariably, what they end up with after many edits is a 5W PSA style script and then they’re perplexed that the results are limited or non-existent.
I understand that these places are almost always board-driven and that a camel is a horse designed by a committee, but can you offer suggestions on creative approaches I might take that are both interesting and engaging but don’t present a choking hazard to boards and committees?
Roy: You could tell them as a professional writer.
Daniel: I want that line.
Roy: Choking hazard.
Daniel: Yeah, a choking hazard. Have you found approaches that are dynamite? How would you sell dynamite creative to a limited budget, risk-averse arts institution? Oh, the irony. Thanks, Roy. You rock. Warren K. Lissel, Magical Worlds ’05.
Roy: ’05 was a while back.
Roy: What year is it now?
Daniel: I think I just graduated junior high in ’05.
Roy: It’s what, 13 years ago.
Roy: Warren, why haven’t you been back, man? These things have changed. Things have changed. It’s good now. It’s actually really good. You could come back. Now, here’s the thing, Warren. At the next board meeting, show the board some examples from outside their category of ads that reveal the effectiveness of focusing not on the product, but on the experience of the customer. Now, here’s how I would begin that journey. Are you ready?
Daniel: Bring it on.
Roy: This is in today’s rabbit hole, which if you’re watching this in the future is [inaudible 00:02:04].
Daniel: Crap. I don’t remember what.
Roy: Don’t matter. You’ll figure it out.
Advertisement: Michael Dell: Remember, what we do is eliminate the middleman and sell custom-ordered PCs made from stock parts direct to the consumer. That’s it. Everyone with me? Good. Hi. Nothing new to report at Dell. We haven’t made any new computers yet, so we just keep selling the old ones for now. Okay. Bye.
Male: Now, this is just an early prototype.
Michael Dell: Looks great. Thanks.
Male: Don’t you want us to turn it on?
Michael Dell: Nah, just start shipping.
Male: We need to make it great.
Michael Dell: No, you need to make it cheap.
Female: What is project MP? A mouse pad?
Michael Dell: Free with every shipment.
Male: Who are we as a company? What do we stand for?
Michael Dell: Don’t think different. Think the same. Guys, we got to make these laptops really thick with the fans in the back so they can see them cooling down.
Male: Suddenly, you need to change the world.
Michael Dell: Let me just.
Male: Why would the E be like M?
Michael Dell: I don’t know. It doesn’t matter. Nothing matters.
Male: Others don’t really care about that stuff.
Male: Michael Dell. Rated PG-13 starts Friday.
Roy: That’s the point. See, that’s the kind of stuff that arts institutions want to do.
Daniel: Yes, they do.
Roy: It’s like really simple, tiny little things. Just put a mouse pad with it. We’re going to …
Daniel: Because they’re caretakers.
Roy: They’re caretakers. Now, here’s the deal. Once you show them this and you say, “That’s what happens when you just talk about … When you think it’s all about the product, it’s all about the offering.” You wind up like Dell. Okay?
Roy: Now, do you realize how ridiculous that ad is?
Daniel: Yeah. I have no idea what they’re selling. You don’t know what it costs. You barely know who it is unless you know the Apple logo is.
Roy: The point is that they showed us a remarkable customer experience. We all project ourselves inside those silhouettes and we want to be those people who are feeling that way and dancing like that. At some weird level, we go, “Yeah, I need that. I need that in my life.”
Daniel: I’ve always thought that people walking around with their headphones outside, it looks ridiculous because that’s usually the kind of thing you hide, right?
Roy: Right, right.
Daniel: It was those commercials that made walking around with your headphones dangling out of your head not stupid.
Roy: The point is, it’s about the customer’s experience. Okay? Now, let’s look at the next one.
Roy: Let’s look at this for a minute. Now, Dell is circling the drain slowly and sadly and they’re headquartered here in
Austin. I mean, it’s a local hero, Michael Dell.
Daniel: We have a lot of their people in classes at the academy.
Roy: Yeah, they’re here a lot. Now, the point is, Apple is the number one company of the Fortune 500. It is the largest company in America, bigger than Walmart, bigger than any of the oil companies, bigger than any of the insurance companies, the largest company in the nation. As a matter of fact, it’s the first company in the history of the world whose market capitalization exceeded $1 trillion. A trillion dollars, a thousand billion and a billion is a thousand million.
Roy: It’s like crap. It’s a billion million. That’s a lot of money.
Daniel: What are you going to do?
Roy: Did it work? It seems to have worked.
Roy: Now, let’s look at a couple more ads.
Advertisement: Here’s to the crazy ones, the misfits, the rebels, the troublemakers, the round pegs in the square holes, the ones who see things differently. They’re not fond of rules and they have no respect of the status quo. You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them, but the only thing you can’t do is ignore them because they change They push the human race forward. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world are the ones who do.
Roy: What do they tell us about the computers?
Daniel: Not a damn thing.
Roy: They just told us about the kind of people they admire and we admire those people so we admire that computer. Let’s look at another one.
Advertisement: Male: Hello. I’m a Mac.
Male: And I’m a PC. Actually, I just finished a home movie.
Male: that’s so funny. I just finished my own home movie. I did an iMovie. It was really easy.
Male: I doubt it’s as excellent as mine, but I’d be happy to take a look.
Male: Yeah, that would be great.
Male: Yeah, roll it.
Female: Hi. I’m a Mac Home Movie.
Male: It looks really professional, right?
Male: Great. Bye.
Male: Wait, wait, wait, wait.
Male: What about you?
Male: Okay. Sure.
Male: What’s up? PC Home Movie.
Male: Work in progress?
Roy: Okay. Now, the only Apple ad that was ever mocked by the public was the one in which they talked about themselves and their product.
Daniel: Yeah. How cool is that?
Roy: The only Apple that … I’m going to show it to you.
Daniel: I don’t know if I remember that one.
Roy: Now, it’s the only ad … Now, listen. It was long so I’m going to play like the first two minutes only.
Roy: Okay? Then I want you to notice the elegant, classy descriptions in this ad. As a matter of fact, you’ll notice, it sounds exactly like the typical ad for a symphony or a museum or anybody in the arts. Are you ready?
Advertisement: You know he’s driven Apple from the beginning. This compulsion to take incredibly powerful technology and make it accessible, relevant and, ultimately, personal. We’ve designed a range of products so personal you don’t put them on your desk or in your pocket, you wear them on your wrist. We conceived, designed and developed the Apple Watch as a completely singular product. You know you can’t determine a boundary between the physical object and the software.
We’re introducing an unparalleled level of technical innovation combined with a design that connects with the wearer at an intimate level to both, embracing the individuality and inspired design. The watch senses that you’re raising your wrist and then activates the display. You see an organization of apps that is somehow familiar. The navigation is fluid and vital.
Roy: Stop it right there because Daniel is … Could somebody wake up Daniel? Now, that you have that in mind, which is exactly how museums liked to talk about themselves and we’re here because we are better than you. Now, that’s what every board member thinks their customer wants in their life is sophistication, refinement, et cetera. Believe it or not, happiness, satisfaction, fulfillment, and joy are what people want, not …
Daniel: And a little bit of peace in their lives.
Roy: Yeah. Here’s the deal. I said this was mocked, right?
Roy: Do you want to see the mockery?
Roy: Let’s see the mockery. Are you ready?
Advertisement: Dartanion London: We wanted to rethink food and create something extraordinary. Introducing Fri. Carefully preserving color and texture, permitted our most elegant model yet. We combined multiple incarnations of oil to create an all-permeating substance we’d like to call smart grease. Smart grease allows the user to know exactly where Fri is or where it has ever been. Fri, enhanced food for the modern world. That’s not all. Introducing Nugget.
Nugget is what happens when machinery meets meat. When you look at Nugget, you see not the contents inside, you see the breading outside. That was intentional. Inside, there’s an advanced piece of food. We can examine the complexity that makes up this product to change the way we experience chickens to change chicken itself.
Oh, and one more thing. Mac. We have refined and refined and refined basic ingredients. The sesame seeds on the bun are there because we put them there. The feel of the Mac is somewhere between firm and soft. The people who are hungry enough to eat the Mac are those who do.
Roy: Here’s the deal. Whenever you get a group’s attention and you give them examples of something like a board of directors and you start talking about … Guys, bad marketing is about the museum and the prices and the patrons and the importance of art in your life. Good marketing is about people who’d come to the museum and how it makes them feel.
Daniel: See, I would love to see the … What’s the movie that we do our intro off of a tower that has that fast cut of someone arriving at the academy, playing cards to the campus.
Roy: I don’t have anything to do with that so no.
Daniel: There’s snatched … Snatched. The movie Snatched, all those cutscenes of travel.
Roy: Right, right.
Daniel: I would love to see a cutscene of someone’s crazy day, kids screaming, doors work then and then sitting in the symphony chair and you hear the sounds of the orchestra warming up and they take the first deep breath.
Roy: The other thing is, I would show them clips from Ferris Bueller’s Day Off.
Roy: When they’re farting around the Chicago museum.
Daniel: Yes, absolutely.
Roy: In other words, whenever you can give people a whole new perspective, but instead of doing it with a debate or an argument or a theory …
Daniel: Show them.
Roy: … you lead through this transformative thing with examples and so you can’t argue with a $1 trillion company. You can argue that Dell is boring and has no personality, but Apple has this amazing personality and culture, at least, it used to.
Roy: Okay. Now, I think we’re for the next question.
Daniel: All right. Bring it on.
Roy: All right.
Daniel: I don’t know. This is your finish.
Roy: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Warren, let’s show them this. Warren, as a prequel to that meeting or perhaps as an alternative, go to YouTube and type in Mick Torbay, Leadership versus the Committee. Now, if there’s any time left at the end of this, I’m going to show you guys that thing. It’s amazing. That’s why we’re going to quickly. It’s 15 minutes, but so many questions that we’re asked this time are very straightforward questions with very straightforward answers.
Daniel: Right. We might be able to get to it.
Roy: Yeah, maybe. We’ll see.
Advertisement: I was a 10-year-old boy holding the flashlight for my dad while he worked on an air conditioner for a customer. His name was Duncan Goodrich. He didn’t talk much, but there’s a certain kind of magic that happens when a son holds a flashlight for his father. I held it steady and quiet and dad talked to me while he worked. He said, “When a person needs help, you respond right away. Not when it’s convenient for you.” He said, “Always do the right thing. Always do what’s right.” He said, “The Goettl Iron Horse is a magnificent machine. Nothing else even comes close.” That was the first time I held a flashlight for my dad, but it wouldn’t be the last.
At dad’s funeral, I realized that every time he handed me that flashlight, he was passing the torch. My dad believed in Goettl air conditioners so I bought the company Goettl, G-O-E-T-T-L. It’ll keep you cool, but it’s hard to spell. Now, you can count on us to respond right away and do the right thing always. No one knows air conditioning like Goettl, G-O-E-T-T-L.
Roy: Daniel, we introduced-
Advertisement: Search your heart and mind. Find your story of origin.
Roy: We introduced that origin story since ASBI began.
Roy: I’ve only known Ken Goodrich since after we started this ASBI webcast and so we’ve shared that before and we’ve shared some of these other examples. I’m continuing to expand upon one’s idea of how do you differentiate the people. By the way, his idea about museums and symphonies and stuff as arts category that was stuck in a rut, most categories are stuck in a rut.
Roy: There’s nothing remarkable about that category being stuck in a predictable rut and just doing what they think you’re supposed to do. This company was in severe trouble after Ken bought it. He tried for two and a half years to turn it around. He sent me an email. I decided to help and I gave him back his email in the form of the radio ad. That’s why he told me …
Roy: … he bought this company. He said, “I love this company. Here’s why I love it. This is why I can’t see it fail.” He was losing like $2.5 million a year trying to keep this company afloat. He did that for about two and a half years. Then, I stepped in, wrote that origin story. We rewrapped the trucks with the picture of him as a little boy holding a flashlight and it took off like a rocket. Let’s listen to about three more ads and then we’ll tell you how that story ends.
Daniel: Rock and roll.
Advertisement: The best home service company is to do background checks and drug tests on prospective employees, but at Goettl Air Conditioning and the Sunny Plumber, we take those evaluations even further because we want you to like the people who come to your home. I mean, really like them. Now, this is going to sound crazy, I know, but I make sure my dog Sadie is there when I meet a prospective new hire. She’s a Wheaten Terrier. Sadie goes straight to the person and gives him her Wheaten greeting, “I know you’re going to be really comfortable with that person in your home.” If Sadie goes off, there’s no way that person’s coming to work for Goettl or Sunny. Sadie is never wrong.
Now, you know I’m crazy, but isn’t it okay to be crazy about hiring likable, happy people that will make sure the customer is delighted? Isn’t it okay to be crazy about old-fashion “do the right thing customer service”? Goettl and Sunny are fabulous companies to work for and they’re fabulous companies to call because everyone who works here is Sadie-certified. Goettl Air Conditioning is contractor-licensed. The Sunny Plumber’s contractor. Goettl Air Conditioning and Sunny Plumber.
Goettl Air Conditioning is contractor-licensed 282081. Goettl Air Conditioning is always open on Christmas Day because one Christmas I got a brand new Stingray Bike, the orange peeler. It had a banana seat and stick shift and shock absorbers and a tiny, little wheel in front. It was magnificent. All I wanted to do was ride it up and down the street and shout really loud so all the other kids would see me.
Just then the phone rang. My dad said, “Kenny, we have a neighbor without any heat. We need to go right now.” We fixed three systems that day and I saw three, very happy families shake my father’s hand and thanked him for coming to the rescue. All three of those families gave me a piece of pie. When we’re finally heading home, dad said, “Christmas is about giving, son. It’s about giving.”
Goettl is open on Christmas Day because you might need us, but I definitely don’t need any more pie because but you know that. Goettl, G-O-E-T-T-L. It’ll keep you cool, but it’s hard to spell.
Contractor license 282081.
Ken Goodrich: Hello? This is Ken Goodrich.
Male: Is it true that Goettl Air Conditioning is 79 years old this year?
Ken Goodrich: Yeah, who is this?
Male: You don’t know me, but I’ve got a great idea for you.
Ken Goodrich: Okay. What is it?
Male: You know that thing you do where you adjust my air conditioner and bring it back to back and clean the exterior coils?
Ken Goodrich: The right way, not the easy way. Rejuvenation.
Male: that’s it. I think you should do it for $79 instead of $129. Since you’re celebrating your 79th birthday and all.
Ken Goodrich: That’s nuts.
Male: Is it more nuts than ask your dog whether you should hire somebody?
Ken Goodrich: You make a good point. What’s your address?
Male: 79 bucks?
Ken Goodrich: 79 bucks.
Male: Rejuvenation. Hey, everybody. Goettl’s famous air conditioning rejuvenation is just $79.
Ken Goodrich: For a limited time.
Male: You use less energy, stay cool and increase the life of your system.
Ken Goodrich. Go to goettl.com, G-O-E-T-T-L.com. It’ll keep you cool, but it’s hard to spell. G-O-E-T-T-L.
Contractor license 282081.
Dear Mr. Goodrich. Thank you for giving my family one of Sadie’s puppies. I keep her in my room with me and she lets me know who I can trust. Are Wheaten Terriers the only dog that gives a Wheaten greeting? My friend Shobe says her dog does that too and it’s not a Wheaten Terrier. Sincerely, Emma McKee.
Dear, Emma. Wheaten Terriers are the only dog that gives a Wheaten greeting, but every other dog has the same skill. They just call it something else. There’s the Basset Hound, howdy; the West Highland, hi; the Yorkshire, yo; the Great Dane, good to see you; the Poodle, please to meet you; the Australian Shepherd, good day, mate; the Wiener dog, long time no see; and the Labradoodle, wassup.
I’m glad you like Sadie puppy and I’m glad she’s keeping you safe. Sadie had 5,000 plus toy pups and we’re delivering them on every air conditioning service call. Thanks for writing, Emma. Ken Goodrich. Goettl, G-O-E-T-T-L. It’ll keep you cool, but it’s hard to spell.
Roy: Now, here’s the thing I want to make clear. Number one, it’s only been like three and a half years. We took off so hard and fast in Phoenix that we went ahead and expand it into Las Vegas and we quit losing money. People love the brand. We never really told them anything about the company other than the stories you’ve heard. Those kinds of stories.
By the way, Rejuvenation is now a registered trademark in the air conditioning category. Not TM, that circle R. Also, the right way, not the easy way is also a registered trademark so don’t use those in the air conditioning business. Ken decided he was going to go into some other cities and he had people begging to invest.
Daniel: Please make me a part of this.
Roy: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Check this out. A few months ago, he sold 30% of the company for $45 million in cash. Now, this is a company that three and a half years ago was losing $2.5 million a year and circling the drain and people expected that it will just fail. You’re looking at these ads because what kind of an idiot would run ads like that. He’s not telling us anything about the company. You’re going, sure, we’re telling you a lot of things about the company. We’re telling about the company beliefs, what the company admires, what the company thinks about and you bond. There’s customer bonding.
You, “I like this, but I just like this people. I like them.” So, when you need somebody in the air conditioning category, you call them. Now, this is the kind of stuff that small-minded people can’t wrap their head around. I can’t cure somebody of small, narrow-mindedness. I just can’t.
Roy: The only way you can get it done is to give them examples, so I loaded up the early part of today’s show with examples and you can find your own examples, but you just want to say, “Look, this is what they did and here’s how it turned out and here’s why it turned out that way.” Now, if you keep giving people the same information you gave them in the past, they’ll keep making the same decision they made in the past. They’ll keep not doing business with you. They’ll keep not coming to your museum or your symphony.
Who’s not in as much trouble as all the rest of the categories? Plays. Whenever the theater says, “These are the plays we’re producing”, every town of any consequence has what’s called Broadway across America where three or four or five years after the show was a big hit on Broadway …
Daniel: It hits the streets.
Roy: … it’ll come to your town. Those things always sell out. Why? Because advertising for plays is way cooler and way more engaging and way more about the customer’s experience than about … There’s the symphony that knew that. Then the symphony always wants to talk snobby and the museums always want to talk snobby and be snobby and they think their patrons expect that. They really don’t. Those patrons have applause and they like to laugh and they like to feel joy.
When you get that through people and you can’t always do it. Okay? When you get that through to them, you can give them remarkable results.
Daniel: Hey, guys. Hope all is well. It’s October. The fall colors are beginning to explode. Liberty Village of Freeport is a retirement community, started with the usual TV commercials, happy faces eating and playing cards. They did okay, but we wanted more. Started talking about Alzheimer’s, you helped write one, I could tell it was personal, then more informational commercials. What happens if Mom runs out of money? Can they transition her to Medicaid or will she have to leave? What happens if Mom falls, do they have on-site physical rehab or will she have to leave? No huge endowment or down payment fees. They’ve been very successful. People come in talking about the commercials.
Now, the next set. The holidays are coming up and people are visiting their parents and that’s when they could see slight changes and become concerned. The script below starts out a 50s aged woman on camera talking about her last visit with Mom. I think we have a video of this one.
Female: I was visiting my mom the other day. She always kept the house so clean. Now, it’s a little messy. The dishes were piling up and the food in her refrigerator was old. I hope she’s taking her daily medication. Then, there are those darn steps.
Female: When you’re seeing these types of little changes, it can mean your loved one needs help. Come talk to us and we’ll explain how your loved one will always have a place at Liberty Village. (singing)
Roy: I’m so proud of Pete. Pete, when we first started doing this a couple of years ago, two and a half years ago maybe. I don’t know. It’s been a while. I remember he was the whipping boy. Every week he’d send in some stuff and I just smack him. I’ll say, “This is horrible, Pete. Here’s what you need to fix.”
Daniel: He’s bulletproof, man.
Roy: He’s a gamer. He goes, “You know what …” He was really hungry to learn and I’ve watched him makes so much more progress and his clients are making serious money now because Pete gets it. Pet says, “You know what, I’m willing to throw myself under the bus for the good of my clients.” Pete, I’ve said this before on the show, but I admire you. His question.
Daniel: His question is, follow-up commercial. The same woman came talking about her visit to Liberty Village and Mom liking the place and no darn steps. The first commercial started in October and runs till end of January. When would you start the second? After the first ends or in mid-December because it’s showing the answer to a concern? Running both from mid-December through January and then the second one alone in February. How would you sequence it?
Roy: There’s not a horrible mistake to be made here. As a matter of fact, the reason you’re struggling between those two ideas, Pete, is because they both have merit in certain ways. You don’t want to run one ad by itself for too long before you replace it with something else. Now, my instinct is my very, very, very best answer is, just create more ads. These are probably running a little too long and so instead of running one of them from October until the end of January, October, November, December, January, then replacing it, God, it’s too long. That’s why we’re tempted or maybe we’re overlapping for a while and then let … or now …
Daniel: Just still spreading that butter too thin.
Roy: Exactly. What happens is, I probably would try to resist running the commercial and the sequel at the same time because it gets confusing. By the time everybody has seen the first commercial a few times, it’s time to start the second commercial. When they’ve seen that one a few times, it’s time to start the third commercial. I think what we’re trying to do here is we’re trying to create two ads to do the job of four. The real answer, Pete, is to write some more ads in that series, extended the series. Write at least one more to air doing that window of time so that you can run one for a couple of months, replace it with a different one. Run it for six or eight weeks. Replace it with a different one. Depending on the schedule, six to eight weeks might even be too long. No matter what the schedule is, I promise that four months is too long. Agree?
Roy: Now, this one’s from the Calgary team. They said we’re seeing more neuroscientific studies on the effectiveness of radio versus TV or digital, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. What’s your opinion of this? I looked at it. I want you to go ahead and read how does it work, just that part.
Daniel: Brainsights measures people’s subconscious responses to audio and visual content. When they wear headsets over their left frontal lobe that measures brainwaves in a second-by-second basis using EEG, three specific mental states have been found to influence advertising results, attention, connection and encoding.
Roy: Yeah. What really comes down to this, these guys have come up with some goofy language, attention, connection and encoding, to describe things that we talked about constantly at Wizard Academy, but we used the real Nobel Prize-winning scientists and the guy that was the head at MIT, Professor Steven Pinker, who was the head of the cognitive science department, brain and cognitive science at MIT for a dozen years. Then about 12 years ago, he left MIT to take that position at Harvard Medical School. He’s written a bunch of books. He was named by Time Magazine a couple of years ago as one of the top 100 most influential people in the world. I’m going, “That’s pretty huge for a college professor.”
When you start talking about how things work, quote the really credentialed people, not some little wormy study by some little wormy people that are just trying to-
Daniel: They try to come up with their own things they could trademark.
Roy: Here’s the deal. What they’re saying is correct. He got of the brain to get people’s attention, but then you have to have relevance.
Daniel: Right. That’s the connection.
Roy: Or, salience as the cognitive neuroscientist call it so that it moves the needle on the who cares meter and they’re going to call that connection. Encoding …
Roy: Now, encoding really has more to do with customer bonding. In other words, it has to relate to something the customer already cares about. It has to connect. This idea about attention, connection and encoding, every good example that I’ve showed you so far in the show has achieved those things. This is a slanderous thing to say. I shouldn’t say it, but I’m saying people you’ve never heard of always sound like they have a hidden agenda. They’re just trying to promote radio.
When you start quoting the people who’ve won the Nobel Prize, they’re not trying to promote radio. When you start quoting the head of Harvard Medical School, he’s not trying to promote radio. If you’re going to quote people … what they’re saying is true, by the way. What they’re saying is absolutely true, but it’s not something that I would quote because they don’t have the gravitas of the status. What’s my opinion of the information? It’s solid, but it’s not the language I would use and it’s not the people I would quote. Okay?
Daniel: Daniel and Roy, Doug Burden’s question about podcasting in the rabbit hole of the October 29, 2018 memo and your answer were interesting because the radio dilemma my son, the pastor has been working on. He’s been doing a one-hour weekly podcast for 10 years. The podcast is now rated number 20 for Christian podcast in the country. He also added a weekly email blog and memo and more recently a YouTube channel with nicely growing subscriber lists. He lives in Aurora, Colorado, but for about six months, he has been doing a live one-hour weekly radio program in a different market, St. Louis, Missouri, on the longest, continually operating Christian radio station KFUO. Not being in the radio industry his dilemma is how to bring his radio program to a radio station in the Denver, Colorado area. If I’m not asking the right question, please give me the answer to the right question. Thanks and Aroo, Church Wolfmueller.
Roy: I like Chuck Wolfmueller. Chuck, listen. I’m going to give you a very detailed answer, but before I do, keep in mind that one of the ASBI tribe here, American Small Business Institute and his name is up here all the time as is yours, these are the people who very frequently ask questions, Bill Montgomery. One of the most important Christian radio stations in America in Columbus, Ohio, the River, 104.9, I think. Bill Montgomery, his information is infinitely more current than mine and if you reach out to Bill Montgomery at the River and told the receptionist who you are, he’d probably take your call and chat with you for a few minutes because first thing I would do, if I want to ask something about Christian radio today …
Daniel: Just call them.
Roy: … that has to be Bill Montgomery. I know Bill and his team are watching so, Bill, if Chuck Wolfmueller calls, take his call, okay? Now, this is the broken-down thing I meant to show you, but I forgot to. All right. It would have been easier to read. Now, Salem Media. This is your answer. My answer, at least. Salem Media is a really large broadcast group. Now, write that number down, Chuck. 805-233-3235. Now, about us. They have a whole bunch of … They have 2,700 affiliate stations. They own … I forget how many. It’s quite a bunch, 115 stations they own, 73 stations in major markets like Denver. I know the founders of that organization, Stu Epperson and Ed Atsinger. They’re brothers-in-law from North Carolina. I’ve known then for 35 years.
Now, one of their stations in Denver is 94.7 FM The Word, KRKS. Get on that if you possibly can. The one that you’d also want to be on, 710 KNUS, is a low dial position AM station so that means the signal will reach like the edge of the world. The lower the dial position of the AM dial …
Daniel: The stronger the signal.
Roy: The longer-
Daniel: That’s why they’re on the early … I didn’t know that.
Roy: Yeah. What happens is the same number of watts down at the bottom of the dial around 540 or 710, right, will go way, way, way, way, way, way, way further, way further than the same number of watts at the top of the dial like 1400 or 1500 or 1600. It has to do how long the wavelength is. Down at the bottom of the dial, one wavelength is like a quarter of a mile long. You take 710 of those of a quarter mile long. That’s going to go like 250 miles with a nine-volt battery for power. Now, up at around 1600 AM, one wavelength is like eight feet long. You take 1600 wavelengths that are eight feet long, it’s only like a mile instead of like 200-mile arrow that you’re shooting out of a bow, you’re shooting like a one-mile arrow.
The fact that 710 will go way, way further than 1600. I’ll say way, way and like in 100 times further, 200 times further. Yeah. It’s going to be an amazing station to get on if you can. Now, they also have at 1690 AM, a little station that’s a little talk station that if that’s all you could do, then go ahead and start there and then get something else. The guy in charge to Salem is David Santrella and that’s the guy that you’d want to talk to, but understand this. In Christian radio, you buy the airtime if they’ll sell it to you. They have to like your show and if you’re a new broadcaster, you’re going to have to take a crappy time slot and they’re not going to promote it for you. You’re going to have to figure out a way to promote your own show.
Daniel: Just like book sales.
Roy: Just like book sales. Just like a band. They don’t build you an audience. They just give you an opportunity to build your own audience. They’ve got three stations in Denver. To get any time slot on any of them, it’s worth starting even if it was late at night. Now, one of the things I did for a friend of mine one time, I put him on a music station and it came on once a week at 10:30 on Sunday night. At 10:30, he came into the live call and show and there’s 10:30 to midnight, an hour and a half. He built this gigantically huge, important church in Tulsa, Oklahoma, he’s retired now, because he had this one a week, late at night show. Yeah, it was on a station that didn’t have any other teaching programs.
There’s always the chance that you could get a low ranked station that plays music in Denver. It wouldn’t be one of the larger ones don’t even try, but even a struggling, little station has a good signal and you could buy some ads to promote the show and they would tune in even at a weird time slot. You know what I mean? You could build your own audience. That’s how to get started. You could do it on a secular station if it was a small enough station and they needed the money and you’d pay them per show. That’s how that works. On Christian radio, they don’t pay you or give it to you for free and then sell the ads in between. You pay them for the time slot.
Daniel: Makes sense.
Roy: They still have to approve the show. They have to like the show. They have to believe in the show. They have to believe in the show or they won’t even let you buy a time slot. That’s how it’s done.
Daniel: I’m starting to work with a client that has an interesting perspective on attracting new business. They’re an industrial supply store, essentially, a candy land for men with beards. They sell power tools, Milwaukee and Makita specifically, but they unique part is you can buy individual tools. In our market, you pretty much have to go to Home Depot and are stuck with those eight-piece combo kits. At any rate, they currently service primarily trade workers and are considering opening the doors to attract a little more of the weekend renovation warrior crowd, but want to stay true to their roots. My question is on inclusive versus exclusive of creative. We want to welcome some of the weekend warriors, but want to stay true to the guys who shop there for a living, basically. Creatively, something in the tone of Ron Swanson. That’s exactly what I was thinking. I wouldn’t normally send you extra work by including a video link, but this is one is seven seconds and you’ll laugh. Thanks. Brother Noble.
Man: Hey, there. Is there a project you’re working on?
Man: I know more than you.
Man: All right.
Daniel: Thank you, Ron Swanson.
Roy: Yeah, that is good. That is good. Now, we’re going to watch it again a second, but let’s go back to the screen, Chad. We want to welcome some of these weekend warriors into the store, but want to stay true to the guys who shop there as part of their living. I’m just having a really hard time, Daniel, trying to imagine the guys who go there all the time because there’s the pro store. Why would they feel betrayed if other people started shopping there?
Daniel: No, I think they’d be … I think the only reason you’d feel betrayed is if what they stocked started changing.
Roy: Yeah. If they started selling cheap stuff, if they started selling gimmicky, cheap stuff …
Daniel: In order to bring in outsiders.
Roy: In other words, if you diminished the quality of what you sell and if you change the store and just try to make more glamorous or glitzy, then they’re going to [inaudible 00:38:45], but if you simply start letting other people come in that aren’t full-time trade professionals, nobody is going to butt-hurt about that.
Daniel: Yeah. I wouldn’t worry about it.
Roy: Here’s why. Because the hardcore guys, they’re coming in Monday through Friday. A happy homeowner is coming in Saturday. If these guys are open Saturday, they’re going to have a really big day on Saturdays that used to not be really big day. I don’t see a downside. I don’t think anybody is going to feel betrayed. As a matter of fact, if you have been shopping some place and you love that place and you hear them advertising, most of the time, you feel like, “Hey, I’m really glad.” These guys are on the move, they’re going places. Evidently, I’m at the right place because they’re getting stronger and stronger. I’m not sharing your fear. I don’t think it is … Now, maybe the client feels, “Oh, we don’t want to lose our …” You’re not going to lose the.
Daniel: This isn’t punk rock, man.
Roy: Yeah. You’re not going to lose the people you previously had. All right? Let’s watch this again.
Man: Hey, there. Is there a project you’re working on?
Man: I know more than you.
Man: All right.
Daniel: All right. What would you recommend in terms of a schedule for a brand new business with the tiny budget? It allows for one of two options. Either one, a small, vertical schedule that can afford to run 52 weeks a year or a higher frequency campaign and they can afford to run for three months. They are in the business of wrapping commercial trucks and vans. It seems to me that they could slowly benefit from option one or we could hope to ring their bell with option two and then they could step up and buy another schedule. They will not have a discount offer. Henry Greenberg.
Roy: I think Henry might be a first-time person asking a question.
Daniel: It’s possible.
Roy: Here’s the deal. Henry, I want to answer this very definitively. Option two is a bad idea. I can only say that because I tried it too many times thinking, “I’ve had this exact same choice you just outlined, exact same choice.” Anytime, I always told the customer, “Man, here are two different things we could do. Here are two different things we could do.” Which one? They’re always attracted to option two.
Daniel: Because it’s a big bump in business.
Roy: They think it’s going to be, but the truth is, on the radio, it takes about three months to start getting any kind of result.
Daniel: Then that’s when you stop.
Roy: What I’m saying is it’s going to take about three months for people to get familiar and they need to understand that no matter what their schedule is. It’s going to take a while for people to get familiar. There is such a thing as a person not having enough money to advertise. If they actually don’t have enough money to advertise, that’s a problem. If I was going to do one of those two, I would go for consistency every week, 52 weeks in a row and just make sure they were going to be patient enough. This needs to be a sustainable amount of money that you can do for three or four months before you start seeing any kind of results. You need to emotionally be prepared for that, not just financially. If you don’t have that conversation up front, we’re going to get two months in and then cancel.
If you do option two and you say let’s just spend all that we have for the year. Let’s spend it in three months hoping that it stimulates enough business that they then will have more courage and more confidence. I’ve tried it too many times. It never once worked so that’s why I quit doing it. Now, maybe I was doing it wrong and maybe you’ll figure out, Henry, how to do it better than I did. All I can tell you is I’ve faced that exact situation a bunch of times and most of the time after talking about it with a client, they went for option two and I always kick myself. The handful of times that I’ve had a colleague that was smarter than me and guided their client into option one, I saw it work. I just said, “You know what …” Bob Lepine was one of those guys. Bob Lepine was a guy that is still widely known.
I’m sure that Bill Montgomery knows him. He’s in Christian radio. Whenever Bob was a sales rep, 35 years ago, he always had the patience of Job. He would put people in this little schedules, but they’re always there and he would make sure the client was ready. I learned a lot from that. I was doing the opposite. I kept doing the opposite even after I saw Bob’s way was working and mine wouldn’t, mine just seemed more …
Roy: Or something. You know what I mean? It was more exciting. There’s a bigger possibilities or something. I finally said, “Yeah, I need to quit doing that.” I’m glad you asked, Henry. I hope I didn’t give you this advice too late. I hope you didn’t convince them to do the big schedule and hope that it was working at the end of 90 days because I don’t think it will be. Now …
Daniel: I have a prospect in the automotive industry that I’ve been working closely with. He recently changed his business name due to canceling his franchise deal and going independent. He knows he needs to rebrand, but despite my consulting and educating, he is a chicken. Do you have any advice on how I can get him to overcome his fear of parting with his money and convince him to move forward with the campaign? Alison Abrahamson. He canceled the one, big marketing advantage and won’t remarket.
Roy: Yeah. All right. Alison, because you always ask good questions, I’m going to give you my best answer, but I’m not guaranteeing it will work. A person convinced against their will remains unconvinced still, but if I was facing this situation and it’s somebody that I really, really, really wanted to sell and I really believe that it was going to be a good relationship, I would go ahead and do the work. I would create not just the spec spot, but three or four ads and a spec campaign and if I really believed in the campaign. I did voluntarily without even getting his permission. I didn’t even get his permission but came out with something I really, really believed in. Sometimes, when you sit down and said, “Look, I did this for you because I really feel like this would work. As a matter of fact, I know it would. Let me just get your feedback on this.”
You play it for him and if it grabs hold of him that he wants to hear that on the air. He really wants to hear that on the air. It’s very likely when you give him something specific to say yes to. It’s not a concept or an idea. It’s an ad that he loves. Listen, we’re going to do this. Don’t write a water-down, half-baked ad. Swing for the fences. Do something that you’re super proud of and here’s why. Even if he doesn’t use it, you’ll strut that ad and you’ll show other people what you’re capable of coming up with saying, “…us this for this guy. He didn’t. He said no.” People are going to, “He’s an idiot. That’s awesome.”
It’s always worth it to create an amazing campaign even if you know it’s not going to get used. I say this with confidence because I did it this morning. I wrote three ads this morning to prove a point. I know they’re not going to get approved, but I wanted to show somebody, “Here’s what you ought to be doing.” I spent a long time on those three ads. They’ll never see the light of day. I’m proud of them. These are my examples in the future even though they’ll probably never air. I still do this to this day. Whenever I think that somebody is making a horrible mistake, I’ll show them what I really think they ought to do. Most people, Alison, don’t have the courage. They just don’t have the courage to break away from the pack and differentiate themselves. Good luck.
Daniel: Roy, you know there are certain people on social media who sell themselves to businesses to endorse their product service. I’m not wondering about the Kardashians, I’m wondering if there is merit in working with Famous Larry who’s local and has a social media following. Are you aware of this ever working? What would Famous Larry charge? Based on what? Kevin. I just want to meet Famous Larry.
Roy: Yeah. He’s somewhere in Canada, right?
Roy: We should do that. Why don’t you grab your laptop or grab my laptop and see if we can find Famous Larry in Canada.
Daniel: I think it’s just a placeholder name. I don’t think it’s a real guy.
Roy: He is put in quotation marks like it’s a thing because I think … You know what …
Daniel: I’ll do it on my phone.
Roy: Do it on your phone. Do it on your phone.
Daniel: Because my laptop’s in my car.
Roy: I’ll read this and while I’m answering this next question, right? You’re going to look up Famous Larry. Now, read this next one. I’ll answer that while you’re looking at Famous Larry. All right?
Daniel: Okay. Roy and Daniel, I’m trying something really weird that I think would be awesome, but I need some help. A Scotsman is contemplating a move to Columbus and calls up a realtor with weird and outlandish questions. Brandi fields them every time and actually shows off her knowledge and skills. Somewhere down the road, Allister will move and they’ll meet face to face. Co-op dollars are involved and that’s why I’m tying in Rob with Union Home Mortgage. I’ve attached my starter scripts. Tell me if I’m on to something. I need to abandon ship. Also, Daniel has to read the-
Roy: Here’s the deal. Yeah, I can’t do that without you, can I? I was going to answer this question …
Daniel: I’m going to try. I think Famous Larry is a placeholder.
Roy: I don’t.
Daniel: There is no Famous Larry.
Roy: You can’t find Famous Larry?
Daniel: No. I think he means as an example-
Roy: Larry is just not that famous.
Daniel: A famous, local guy.
Roy: Is that what you’re saying?
Daniel: I’m saying he’s not a real Larry. I’m saying he’s just saying-
Roy: I’m that Famous Larry with kind of an interesting name.
Daniel: I know. I want to meet the actual Famous Larry.
Roy: There’s no Famous Larry. I was going to say if we can’t find Famous Larry, then I’d say, no, don’t. He’s not that famous. All right.
Daniel: I’m going to jump ahead on David Long and tell you, David, let the Scotsman be a Scotsman without trying to insert some stereotype Scotsman slang. That’s going to get everybody to just roll their eyes.
Roy: Yeah, yeah. I’m going to point this out. In one of the scripts, we’d say lassie went too many times.
Daniel: Like eight times. It was really only twice, but it felt like eight.
Roy: You can only say Lassie once. Otherwise, it sounds like you’re forcing it. Now, I was going to say that so you beat me to it.
Daniel: Because that was my line.
Roy: the same thing.
Daniel: He wants me to read the lines and I’m like, “I’m not reading lassie eight times.”
Roy: By the way, get a real Scotsman to record.
Daniel: Yeah, not Daniel.
Roy: There’s nothing worse than accents that are acted.
Daniel: A case in point. You’ll be a joke for forever like for example, “Oi, Mary Poppins. How are you,” said Dick Van Dyke’s first English accent ever.
Roy: Exactly. Are you ready to read this?
Daniel: Yeah, sure.
Roy: Now, you got to-
Daniel: I’ll make a fool of myself, but I’ll commit.
Roy: You can do better Scottish than most people.
Daniel: I will commit.
Roy: You really can because of the whiskey thing.
Daniel: All my Scottish friends, you can just make fun of me later. That’s fine.
Roy: Hi. Brandi Newland, Remax Realty.
Daniel: Hello, lassie. The name’s Allister MacDonald. I heard you’re the name to know in the wee town of Columbus, Ohio if a certain fellow wanted to buy a house.
Roy: I’ve been selling houses here awhile, so I guess you could say that. How can I help you, Allister?
Daniel: Me thinks I want a place to call home and I’d like you to help me. Are you up for it?
Roy: Sure thing. Want to grab some coffee sometime next week?
Daniel: No can do. I’m 3,628 … and that should be kilometers, by the way, not miles and it’s not 300 … away in beautiful Edinburgh, but I’ll be in touch again soon.
Daniel: Who was that?
Roy: Sounds like I made a new Scottish friend.
Daniel: The next time you should tell him about your really good friend Rob Barry from Union Home Mortgage.
Roy: Oh, Rob. Don’t worry. I have a feeling we’ll be hearing from Mr. MacDonald again. Now, remember, that’s not how real people would talk. Look at that last screen, right? She might say, “Sounds like I made a new Scottish friend.” “Next time, you should tell him about your other really good friend, Rob Barry from Union Home Mortgage.” Now, she would not say, “Oh, Rob.” She wouldn’t do that. Only in a commercial, only in bad commercial would somebody say, “Oh, Rob.” You wouldn’t do that. She just got to, “Oh, don’t worry. I think we’ll be hearing from him again.”
You wouldn’t say Rob and you wouldn’t say Mr. MacDonald a second time. If your force him, Mr. MacDonald’s name after you just through using him, it makes it sound a little bit. No, wait a minute.
Daniel: Or, you could say, “Uh.”
Roy: I’m being really critical here. I forgot to say …
Daniel: Yeah, I like the concept.
Roy: … it’s a good ad. I like the ad. I’m nitpicking-
Daniel: Because there’s a story here.
Roy: Exactly. In other words, I need a backup. It’s 95% really good.
Daniel: Yeah, that’s why I was.
Roy: We’re nitpicking the 5% that sounds a little bit like adspeak, all right?
Daniel: Because I would then add with something like it could have been a prank call, but if not we’re probably be hearing from him again.
Roy: Exactly, yeah. Now, let’s look into the screen here, Chad. “No can do, lassie.” Now, we’ve already said lassie so he’s just going to say, “No can do. I’m 4,791 kilometers away in beautiful Edinburgh.” Now, he would say Edinburgh, Scotland.
Daniel: Right. That’s why I left that-
Roy: I wouldn’t say Austin, Texas, America. It’s just like, “I’m in Austin.”
Daniel: Actually, he would also say, “I can’t do it. Can’t do it.” Right? It’s going to be a faster slang like, “No can do.” That’s too …
Roy: Yeah, yeah. Can’t do it. A real Scotsman is going to modify these things probably anyway.
Daniel: Yeah, let them have free rein with the idea of the sentence.
Roy: He says, “There’s many kilometers away in beautiful Edinburgh.” The weather is lovely this time of day. Nice and drizzly. All right. Now, there’s a 30-second version. Are you ready?
Daniel: Yeah. Bring it on.
Roy: MacDonald. Hold on, Rob. I have a phone call. Hello, Brandi Newland, Remax Realty.
Daniel: Hello, lassie. The name’s Allister MacDonald. I’m looking at buying a home in the wee town of Columbus. I’d like you to help me.
Roy: I’d be happy to, Allister. When would you-
Daniel: That’s great to hear. I’ll be in touch.
Roy: Click. Rob, I think, we’ve made a new friend.
Daniel: Does he need Union Home Mortgage? I like those friends.
Roy: We’ll see. I just hope we hear back from him.
Daniel: I like that one better, actually, because it’s so chopped and he was forced to leave out a bunch which makes dialogue so much better. I like that Allister hung up on her when she said she could help. Oh, good. All right then.
Roy: Now, we’re going to come back to Famous Larry.
Daniel: All right.
Roy: All right. Don’t let me forget.
Daniel: Don’t forget.
Roy: Come back from the Famous Larry.
Daniel: All right. Daniel and Roy, we have a new company, Premier Clean, that’s coming on the air this month. Husband and wife owners, he’s a retired Marine, she’s a doctor. Starting with an origin story and looking for your feedback. We weren’t excited about the name or the web URL. I agree. We would love to see them go with Marine Clean or something different that doesn’t use such ubiquitous word as Premier. It’s difficult to do SEO or dot biz extensions. Agree? Are there better ways to make URLs more memorable? They currently have search engine problems. Yeah, no kidding. We’re trying to get them some help. Bill Montgomery.
Roy: Now, remember. Because they went with a generic name, Premier Clean, dot-com was gone so they got the dot biz.
Daniel: You’re never going to win that SEO battle search battle.
Roy: Here’s the other problem. People are going to go to the dot com. They’re not going to the dot biz.
Daniel: No matter how many times you say it.
Roy: No matter how many times you say it if they even remember Premier Clean. Premier Clean is just white noise.
Daniel: The number one-
Roy: It doesn’t conjure anything in your mind.
Daniel: The number one director into wizardacademy.org is wizardacademy.com that forwards to wizardacademy.org.
Roy: I know.
Daniel: People who come like six times a year still type wizardacadem.com into the URL.
Roy: Thank goodness we own that.
Roy: We use that as a pointer. Now, this is Bill Montgomery, the new friend of Chuck Wolfmueller. The good news is when I saw this question, I emailed Bill the answer. I told him, “You need to snag this before the show,” but the first thing I did is I love the name Marine Clean.
Daniel: Yeah, me too.
Roy: Because when you look at the origin story in just a minute, the guy’s a Marine. As a matter of fact, there’s no such thing as a former Marine.
Daniel: Yeah, it’s just a Marine.
Roy: When you’re a Marine, you’re a Marine for the rest of your life. Every Marine knows this and by married to a Marine knows this. There’s no such thing as a former Marine. Marine Clean works for a lot of reasons, marineclean.com, not available. I checked.
Advertisement: Melissa: When we first hired a home cleaner, I was worried about feeling like I was the one that was letting the family down by not doing the housecleaning, but it was my husband Rick who actually convinced me that having a pro doing the cleaning would allow me to be more of a mom and a wife and a provider.
Rick: I was tired of losing the coin flip to do the bathrooms.
Melissa: ultimately, it turned out to be a life-changer and it’s also one of the reasons we started our own home-cleaning business, Premier Clean.
Rick: The sweet woman who cleaned our house changed our life and became family. Now we’re doing the same for families across Columbus.
Melissa: Talk about the safety, babe.
Rick: We were concerned about who would be in our home.
Melissa: Enter my husband, the Marine.
Rick: Let’s just say this. Our cleaners go through a marine style process to ensure safety and white-glove quality.
Melissa: While we won’t clean your home for free, you’ll find it’s less than you think and worth every penny for you and your family.
Rick: Like you, we love the River and want to clean homes of people like us.
Melissa: If you could use a cleaning life-changer, find us at premierclean.biz.
Roy: Now, it’s a good origin story, but there are like four ads in that ad. It’s a good origin story about a former Marine and you have to do things really diligently. Right?
Roy: When you’re a former Marine. What I told Bill in this email was snag marinedoubleclean.com and I checked and marinedoubleclean.com can be bought for entry money like the lowest possible price. It was like a buck or something. It’s nothing. Marine Double Clean and so when things are doing double time, double time. The whole deal, Marine Double Clean opens up a door for a huge creative campaign, infinitely memorable. Marine Double Clean, is it clean? Yes. Is it Marine double clean?
Daniel: Double check it.
Roy: Yeah, double check it. Double clean. I love the name you guys came up with, Marine Clean, not available. Marine Double Clean is, dot com. They really need to do this because these are obviously people who are going into a business kind of stumbling in for the first time and everybody makes the same mistakes. They want to use a philosophical statement like premier as the best chemical kind of thing. Then, they want to figure out how to build that company. I’m going, no, no, no. The first thing you have to do is have a surprising, delightful, memorable name that nobody else is using and we know nobody is using it other than Marine clean is taken. You never heard of a cleaning company that was using Marine style discipline and Marine-style quality control and precision, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. I love it. I love the idea. I don’t want to hear that these people are stuck with a Premier Clean. That would break my heart.
Daniel: Yeah. Me too.
Roy: Right now. Famous Larry, right? Is it worth doing? Look, if I was going to toss Famous Larry a few bucks, it might be 100 or 150 bucks, honestly. I would say, “Give us a really solid plug. Let’s just watch what happens.” Now, if anybody with a social media following can actually … has a tribe of followers, they can generate a really meaningful response pretty quickly because-
Daniel: You’ll know.
Roy: They have a high level of engagement and you’ll just come up with some work with them, come up with something that he’s willing to do, that he feels good about with his tribe. I’m saying he’s cheap enough. If he didn’t want to do it for 100, 150 bucks, then tell him to eat dirt and die. It’s just like this is not a big, international superstar. It’s a guy that local that has a following and, you know what, that kind of money, if he says there might be a future here, I just need to demonstrate that these guys will respond and work with him to come up with kind of an interesting offer. Something that’s fun and that his people could get behind and make themselves known. See what I mean? So that it has a built-in word flag. It has a built-in tracking mechanism. Daniel, we only got two minutes, but you said you had a question.
Daniel: Yeah. I never get to ask questions, but we had a little bit of extra time and then at the end of this go watch that video …
Roy: With Mick Torbay.
Daniel: With Mick Torbay. It’s freaking amazing.
Roy: Yeah. Leadership versus the Committee, Mick Torbay.
Daniel: Plus, Mick’s just a good-looking man. We’re just now getting to the point with the [inaudible 00:59:23] story where I think maybe we could market it a little bit and start talking about some things. We’re going to handle on it. My first thought was we can’t do radio yet because it’s expensive and we don’t have that money, but maybe billboards and we happen to have some billboards right down the road from us that are dramatic, well-placed. We were looking at them and Devin said, “Why don’t you let me take a look and see how we could get those four and if they’re a major company, we might be able to pile it into things?” We were thinking we would want to promote springtime hanging out outside on the deck.
My question was, assuming any of those things are a good idea, would there be any upside to getting in on that billboard now and creating a campaign that has a bunch of things that make you ask questions, but no answers until the reveal of what we’re talking about in spring or something that leads up to a now it’s time to sit outside in Austin, now you come to join us. A slower roll of a campaign.
Roy: All right. Because I drive down that street every day, I know there’s only about four boards you could even be talking about.
Daniel: All the ones the neighbors are mad about.
Roy: Okay. Close, so on the other side.
Daniel: On the other side.
Roy: You’re going to be surprised. Number one that those are going to be expensive. Number two, kind of the deal breaker is the cost of production. In other words, every time you change the image, you got serious money. Creating it on the computer is not the money. Having it painted is the money. The cost of production causes me to say, “You know what, I would just get a board I was going to leave up for a year,” because-
Daniel: And don’t kick it until you’re ready to get attention.
Roy: Right. What happens … but remember, believe it or not, is a really good picture of the thing in feather with the decks and you say the world’s only crowdsourced whiskey or something because the defining thing is it’s an educational organization and all the whiskey recipes are crowdsourced from the tribe and to try to communicate, you’ve got an image plus eight words and so also, you could say one mile ahead, turn on Crystal Hills Drive. Turn right on Crystal Hills, one mile. You could give them that direction. They see this thing. It looks like it’s an attractive, fun place to hang out, still gorgeous which it is, but when you’d have to have a total of eight words, eight words and picture, but I think Devin’s going to tell you that the monthly is probably more than he thought it was going to be. I promise you that changing the board is more expensive than you realized.
Roy: Is it a bad idea? No. It’s more expensive-
Daniel: It’s an expensive idea.
Roy: I think it’s more expensive than you suspect unless you’re sitting on a lot more cash than I know about.
Daniel: Is there a general upside do you think to looking into that billboard and doing it for us?
Roy: Yeah. Yeah, I think it’d be good if it can be had for reasonable money. Obviously, we haven’t talked about this, but we just burned up the last two minutes. Thank you, guys, for your questions. I want to hear back on whether or not Famous Larry took enough money to buy a really nice dinner with somebody he cares about and …
Roy: … prove he had some influence. All right?
Daniel: All right.
Roy: All right. See you guys later.